Donald Trump

[pipbarber]

As am I.

New York Times is sounding very pessimistic
....

As am I. But even if Biden scrapes in, by college votes, we'll have another round of stolen election claims and probable maga violence and dysfunction.

On the other hand...polling. My trust levels on US polls is not exactly solid, who the fuck knows.

[stevebrooks]

As am I.

New York Times is sounding very pessimistic
....

As am I. But even if Biden scrapes in, by college votes, we'll have another round of stolen election claims and probable maga violence and dysfunction.

On the other hand...polling. My trust levels on US polls is not exactly solid, who the fuck knows.

On the other hand, Trump will very likely be dead or institutionalised by the election after, it's very likely MAGA will implode completely if Trump is gone, I mean look at the chaos at the moment and imagine it with no central figure to churn around!

[pipbarber]

I'm watching the debate and Biden is awful. Trump is obviously deranged but he appears cognitively alive, unlike Biden. He can barely speak in coherent sentences. This is shocking!

[stylofone]

I'm watching the debate and Biden is awful. Trump is obviously deranged but he appears cognitively alive, unlike Biden. He can barely speak in coherent sentences. This is shocking!

Well you're a sucker for punishment. I'm just looking at the odd bit of live reporting on websites, no video until I watch the evening news tonight.

I was reading a commentary on the UK election yesterday and it reeked with disillusionment about the poor quality of the choice people are being offered. There seems to be a broad erosion of democracy, as well as the active attacks on it by the likes of Trump, Putin et al.

[stylofone]

NYT commentary is dire.

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/25/opin ... mance.html

Thirty minutes into the presidential debate, I’ve heard from three veteran Democratic presidential campaign officials, and all of them had the same reaction to President Biden’s performance: This is a disaster.

It wasn’t just that Biden wasn’t landing a glove on Donald Trump on the economy, the overturning of Roe v. Wade, Covid, taxes, temperament or anything else that was coming up in the questioning. It was Biden’s voice (low and weak) and facial expression (frozen, mouth open, few smirks) with answers that were rambling or vague or ended in confusion. He gave remarks about health care and abortion that didn’t make a strong point, giving Trump a chance to give lines like, “I really don’t know what he said at the end of that sentence, I don’t think he know what he said either.”

One of the Democrats said he looked scared. Another said it was an “emperor has no clothes” performance so far. The third said of the performance overall, “Don’t ask.”

Trump lied repeatedly during the debate about the pandemic, immigration and Roe v. Wade, but Biden didn’t hold him accountable for those lies in a memorable way. At times, Trump attacked Biden, but the president didn’t fight back.

Frank Luntz, the veteran focus group moderator who was holding a live focus group during the debate, wrote of their reactions so far: “The group is so bothered by Biden’s voice and appearance. But they’re getting madder and madder with Trump’s personal attacks.”

“If Trump talks less,” Luntz said, “he wins. If Biden doesn’t stop talking, he loses.”

[pipbarber]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng- ... ity-ruling

The US supreme court has ruled that former presidents are entitled to some degree of immunity from criminal prosecution, a major victory for Donald Trump that guts the 2020 election subversion case against him and any prospect of a trial before November.

Well, that seems to be one of the dumber decisions of the supreme court. Inject a bit of legal immunity into the office that a dictator adjacent candidate is running for - fucking hell, what a bunch dickheads.

I guess the amazing thing is that the Dems, in their four lonely years in power failed to expand the supreme court to balance out the crazy fuckers appointed by Trump. Which i guess is just another example of them doing 20th century politics in the 21st century. Trump 2.0 is really looking scary.

[stylofone]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng- ... ity-ruling

The US supreme court has ruled that former presidents are entitled to some degree of immunity from criminal prosecution, a major victory for Donald Trump that guts the 2020 election subversion case against him and any prospect of a trial before November.

Well, that seems to be one of the dumber decisions of the supreme court. Inject a bit of legal immunity into the office that a dictator adjacent candidate is running for - fucking hell, what a bunch dickheads.

I guess the amazing thing is that the Dems, in their four lonely years in power failed to expand the supreme court to balance out the crazy fuckers appointed by Trump. Which i guess is just another example of them doing 20th century politics in the 21st century. Trump 2.0 is really looking scary.

I have a vague hope that this sort of thing will scare people back to the ballot box to stop Trump again like they did in 2020.

I have a less vague fear that the MAGA forces will be emboldened, and the swinging voters will be disillusioned and stay home, ignoring the first rule of tyranny prevention "do not obey in advance".

[stevebrooks]

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng- ... ity-ruling

The US supreme court has ruled that former presidents are entitled to some degree of immunity from criminal prosecution, a major victory for Donald Trump that guts the 2020 election subversion case against him and any prospect of a trial before November.

Well, that seems to be one of the dumber decisions of the supreme court. Inject a bit of legal immunity into the office that a dictator adjacent candidate is running for - fucking hell, what a bunch dickheads.

I guess the amazing thing is that the Dems, in their four lonely years in power failed to expand the supreme court to balance out the crazy fuckers appointed by Trump. Which i guess is just another example of them doing 20th century politics in the 21st century. Trump 2.0 is really looking scary.

I have a vague hope that this sort of thing will scare people back to the ballot box to stop Trump again like they did in 2020.

I have a less vague fear that the MAGA forces will be emboldened, and the swinging voters will be disillusioned and stay home, ignoring the first rule of tyranny prevention "do not obey in advance".

Well, remember when Trump wanted to have an aide executed for for revealing he went to the bunker in the white house during the riots, well now he can have him executed! Along with anyone else he accuses of treason.....that's a looooooong list, I sure hope the Trumpsters are starting to get worried!

[pipbarber]

....
Well, remember when Trump wanted to have an aide executed for for revealing he went to the bunker in the white house during the riots, well now he can have him executed! Along with anyone else he accuses of treason.....that's a looooooong list, I sure hope the Trumpsters are starting to get worried!

Ah...but the Trumpsters won't be targeted....not them....Don't you know that dictators with unaccountable power only ever target the true enemies of the state, not their loving devoted fans, not the good citizens, oh no, the good people will always be safe and sound....comrade...and did you just say something negative about the glorious president...citizen?

Actually, Judith Bartler's most recent book (which i'm yet to read) explores the reasons behind people supporting unaccountable power and the delusion of immunity. Probably a good time to read that (note to self). In any case, my point i guess is just that. The Trumpsters will consider themselves immune from president Trump's cruelties - and that is a delusion, as pretty much every violent, murderous dictator throughout all of history has proven, but is there a more deluded cohort than the maga movement?

I don't know the full extent of Trump's future powers should he win the election, but from a superficial reading, the supreme court has opened the gates of hell.

[pipbarber]

Well, the supreme court ruling does indeed seem to constitute the institutionalization of dictatorship. Perhaps this will be the last US election? A president Trump could, in theory, arrest all democrat candidates running for office in the lead up to the 2028 election, claiming they were conspiring against the state, or some such charge. This could all go down hill so fast. Remember the speed of the Soviet collapse? The sudden disappearance of European communism? How about the sudden disappearance of US democracy? I would think that will almost certainly happen if Trump wins.

It's probably not quite as dramatic as all that, given that US democracy has never been overly democratic. First past the post duopolies don't really provide much democracy, especially when the two parties are ideologically identical, which in the US they have been since at least the 1970s. Oddly enough though, at this moment in time the two parties do actually represent a significant divide. The procedural corporate backed representative democracy they're all used to versus a legally immune corporate backed dictatorship.

Right feelings, wrong facts. It's absolutely justifiable to reject the pointlessness of a political system that is corrupted by money and corporate power. A system that is impoverishing and brutalizing its populace, should be attacked, rejected, reformed - but not replaced by a much worse one party rule, which is where they're headed.

We're barrelling toward a grand historical moment that could lead anywhere. I can't imagine how the average person in the US (who isn't a maga nut) is feeling right now. It must be very intense, scary.