Electric + Human-Powered Vehicles

[stevebrooks]

A review of 3 EV's!

The instrument setup alone would see me put a big fat red cross next to the Tesla, it's ludicrous. It may have the longest range, but I can't possibly see having the vital data all displayed in the middle of the dash to be at all safe or useful. Having thought about this design a bit it comes down, I think, to two major points. The first, of course, it's far cheaper to send everything to a single display....which if course is also a single point of failure, what happens if a kid throws something and breaks the screen. The second is Musk's devotion to self driving, even though it currently seems shrouded in failure. I suspect it's his idea that drivers simply won't be driving, so why put all the information in front of them?

Anyway here it is, the Tesla is the fastest and longest range, but this comes with questions also, I mean wtf is this?

It’s the slowest here, completing the benchmark 0-100km/h sprint in 7.3 seconds.

7.3 seconds for 0-100kph used to be the arena of serious muscle cars, 7.3 seconds is not slow by any means!

But yeah, I give Tesla 0 points for instrument layout, even bordering on the dangerous and shouldn't be allowed on the road. A lot of modern cars now come with sensors that detect road attention and give audible warnings if you take your eyes away from the road for a certain period of time, can't see how the Tesla would manage with that! Not only that, you know, it's actually an ugly interior!

https://www.news.com.au/technology/moto ... 34043b4bd2

[Irrev-Black]

@stevebrooks - I visit a 100 zone perhaps three or four times a year.

I suspect my criteria aren't going to point me at a Tesla any time soon.

[stevebrooks]

@stevebrooks - I visit a 100 zone perhaps three or four times a year.

I suspect my criteria aren't going to point me at a Tesla any time soon.

Exactly, this is also my issue with range anxiety, it's a basically an invented problem, I know a lot of people who have never driven more than 100km from home. Why do we want electric cars with sub 4 second 0-100kph and 500km+ driving range? Well we don't really, but it justifies the high price a lot of EV makers put on their cars, ooh look how fast it goes.

But there's a difference between want and need, some people do need extra driving range, so range is important for EV's because some people do take them out of the city/town, but these are probably the same people who cart along a couple of jerry cans of fuel or have a second fuel tank in their 4x4, so paying extra for extra range shouldn't be an issue, people already do it, but the vast majority of EV's would be fine with a sub 400km driving range because they simply don't go further than that on a single trip. So why don't car companies have cars of the same model with different driving ranges? Cheaper cars of basically the same model with smaller batteries for city use where the only difference would be battery size and cost?

[stevebrooks]

Huh, the Polestar, incorporates exactly what I suggested in previous post, same car with long range and short range options, although I think the standard range is still further than 90% of people will ever drive in one day, options of dual or single motors, the long range is certainly superior to the Tesla, 532km and 654km respectively, if you pick the single motor option, 591km with dual motors. I mean even 532km is good range for an electric car, 654km is exceptional for an EV at the moment, although I think that will change soon.

https://www.news.com.au/technology/moto ... ec4c76b735

[joele]

Huh, the Polestar, incorporates exactly what I suggested in previous post, same car with long range and short range options,

The atto 3 has the same, well standard range and long range, being 410 and 480km respectively.. The price difference is about $3k and the sales of the standard range, based on the feedback on the byd facebook page, is almost non existent (>90% of people report buying the extended range)...

I think the problem is there being too slight a price difference?

I also like in that article about the polestar when they discuss alternatives they list the most expensive performance variant of the BYD seal (at 68k) when the base one is still more than enough for 99.9% of people and only cost $49k

[stevebrooks]

Huh, the Polestar, incorporates exactly what I suggested in previous post, same car with long range and short range options,

The atto 3 has the same, well standard range and long range, being 410 and 480km respectively.. The price difference is about $3k and the sales of the standard range, based on the feedback on the byd facebook page, is almost non existent (>90% of people report buying the extended range)...

I think the problem is there being too slight a price difference?

Yes that's almost certainly the issue, the same will apply to the Polestar, if it was 10k cheaper they might see a lot of take up. Currently estimated cost of a EV battery is around AU$9500 for a 50kwh battery, the Polestar long range has a 82kwh battery, that's nearly double, say around AU13,000 for the battery. But we are only looking at chopping of 15% of the range, even so the price difference is to small between the two to account for that at only $1500, it should be at least %2000, probably more like $2500, but still the price difference is to small to warrant getting the sorter range. If the range was around 400kms for the standard with a much smaller battery you could get between $5k and $7k savings, that would make a difference in what people are willing to pay. Essentially the price differential of $1500 between the standard and long range Polestar is to small to make much impression on people. People with the money to afford one will probably always pay the extra $1500 for the extra range, I know I would.

However that will probably become even less relevant as the price of batteries drop, I must admit the price differential between the standard and long range options will irrelevant for most people in the future because batteries will make up less and less of the total cost of the car so it's likely we will actually see fewer cars with different range options and manufacturers will just opt for one size to make bulk purchase and construction cheaper and easier.

Note, costs are estimated from current production costs in China and may not be exactly the same as purchase cost in other countries but should transfer across relatively well because most of these manufacturers probably buy Chinese made batteries anyway.

[Irrev-Black]

Petrochemical dollars and fossil foolery?

Last year, Australians paid over $60 billion to import petroleum products. On top of that we paid tens of billions of dollars for storage, distribution and sales of these products, often to overseas-owned businesses.

Efficient electrification can dramatically reduce this substantial drain on our economy as well as reduce consumer costs and deliver other benefits.

Obviously a shift to electric cars will cut imports of petrol, which comprises 41% of petroleum consumption. While our overall use of petrol and diesel fuel is dominated by transport (71% of petroleum), about 40% of diesel fuel (around 29% of total petroleum) is used for non-road transport activities, particularly mining.

Many mines use a lot of diesel fuel for trucks, but also for electricity generation. The Australian government’s ‘Safeguard’ scheme limits scope 1 carbon emissions (from on-site emissions, often from burning fossil fuels) of high emission sites like these, with a potential carbon price of up to $75 per tonne.

https://thedriven.io/2024/04/13/electri ... port-bill/

[stevebrooks]

Oh dear cybertruck, it seems US car manufacturer self certification isn't worth the paper it's written on, how could this slip by?

[Irrev-Black]

Try and find out what battery technology is in the car, even on the manufacturers website (let alone the reviews)..

And FFS we don't need electric cars with artificial engine noise, do we? I actually love that my car is quiet...

No we don't need speakers that make sound, but if it did I would want a Tardis sound.

I want clip-cloppetty hoof noises with random snorts, neighs, and whinnies.

No idea what it sounds like, but it's law.

‘Quiet’ cars such as electric and hybrid vehicles must now legally make a warning sound at low speeds to help people who are blind or vision impaired stay safe, it has been announced today.

Federal Transport Minister Catherine King announced the new Australian Design Rule (ADR) on Friday, with it set to be mandated on all new electric, hybrid and hydrogen cars – as well as trucks and buses – when travelling under 25km/h by no later than November 2025.

The noise – known as an Acoustic Vehicle Alerting System (AVAS) – is a safety alert or sound emitted when an electric vehicle is travelling at low speeds in places such as car parks, intersections, and driveways.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/warning-n ... nd-people/


Now I want a ban on muted greys and such so deaf buggers like me can see 'em coming.

[stevebrooks]

Nissan Qashqai-epower, hybrid that uses petrol motor to charge the battery, doesn't supply any info on range just running on battery, but I am guessing most of the time on long trips it will be using the petrol motor to charge. Interestingly the hybrid costs more than the full electric, which really shouldn't be surprising since there are a lot of extra components, and shorter service intervals because, of course, petrol motor and etc.

https://www.news.com.au/technology/moto ... 813cf32e67