Electric + Human-Powered Vehicles

[Irrev-Black]

Too much autonomy?

He said: "I realised something was wrong when I was coming up to a roundabout, and went to slow down - but it didn't do it. Then I heard a loud grinding noise that sounded like break pads - but because it was such a new car I knew it couldn't be a problem with them.

"I managed to get around roundabout going at about 30mph, and and then had long road ahead of me, so I assumed it would stop without me accelerating - but it didn't. I have mobility issues, so I couldn't even jump out - I was completely trapped inside the car going at 30mph.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scot ... r-31099702

More autonomous vehicle japery!

https://www.drive.com.au/news/erratic-r ... assengers/

[stylofone]

I was in Canberra yesterday and radio news reported traffic trouble on the Cotter Road because an EV had broken down right in the middle of the road and couldn't be moved. Now they don't normally say, for example, a diesel ute has broken down. But it is interesting I guess, they are still a new thing and probably worth mentioning if you are a radio presenter. I note that in a recent survey the Tesla Model Y - the top selling EV in Australia was the third worst model, although often it was for fiddly little things rather than actually breaking down.

https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/cons ... tudy-2021/

[joele]

I was in Canberra yesterday and radio news reported traffic trouble on the Cotter Road because an EV had broken down right in the middle of the road and couldn't be moved. Now they don't normally say, for example, a diesel ute has broken down. But it is interesting I guess, they are still a new thing and probably worth mentioning if you are a radio presenter. I note that in a recent survey the Tesla Model Y - the top selling EV in Australia was the third worst model, although often it was for fiddly little things rather than actually breaking down.

https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/cons ... tudy-2021/

BYD didn't get a mention, too small in the US I guess.. To be honest reliability is important but I think willingness to repair issues under warranty is more important to me.. Mazda is the perfect example, very high reliability (as shown in that report) but I had issues with my, soon to be previous, car and getting them to even acknowledge it was an absolute nightmare... They would literally say anything to avoid accepting there is a problem when under warranty, Skoda/VW were also bad on that front in my experience, but Hyundai were pretty good. I seem to be one of those lucky people that often gets struck by issues under warranty.

I test drove the BYD Atto 3 today, very nice car, even more-so for the price when compared to all the old guard's EVs. Will place order on Monday and get it done. It isn't a sport car (not like the new BYD Seal Performance, that does 0-100kmh in 3.8 seconds) but I don't need that, still had plenty of go, but what I noticed most was how smooth and quiet it was.

Also heard something interesting from the dealer (well not dealer as you buy online, test drive assistant?). He was saying a number of people are cancelling their Tesla orders to get the BYD Seal (announced this week) and Tesla were offering to price match when they cancel, which depending on model will be $4k or more discount. Still wouldn't want to drive an Elon Musk car, nope, no way, but good sign that BYD (and MG) are creating some competition to drive down prices.. I did look at the Kia Niro EV too, same size battery (but Li-Ion rather than LFP) and it was twenty thousand more expensive than the BYD Atto 3, ummm, why are people buying that? It's not like people would pay thousands more for a KIA badge? would they?

[Irrev-Black]

What is a used EV worth?

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos- ... 023-10-23/

[joele]

What is a used EV worth?

From the article

A consumer who wants a used EV with 90% of its range when new could end up buying one with just 70% because of the previous owner's bad charging habits

The Interesting thing is if they are talking Lithium Cobolt Oxide (LCO) batteries which is very likely they are considering it is in the majority of EVs that "bad charging habit" is simply regularly charging to 100% capacity rather than 80%.. Of course now cars are a disposable item (as capitalism), built in obsolescence is a good thing I suppose.

[joele]

I get my BYD with LFP battery next week according to dealer.. So today I was at the servo filling up my ICE car and realised this may well be the last time I put petrol into my own car, kind of strange feeling.. goodbye petroleum combustion.

On another note I saw QLD are bringing in a new law to stop self sufficiency.. They are going to require all households installing a home charger to connect it to a "controlled load circuit" at the cost of $4k.. The bigger problem is a controlled load circuit runs seperate to the power for the rest of your house and means you CANNOT utilise the power generated by your solar installation to charge your car.

I assume other states will bring that in too, I just hope it isn't retrospective as I will be installing my solar triggered charger (charges when I have excess solar) in a few weeks and that will be a giant waste if I have to get a controlled circuit retrofitted.

https://thedriven.io/2023/06/19/queensl ... -industry/

[stylofone]

I get my BYD with LFP battery next week according to dealer.. So today I was at the servo filling up my ICE car and realised this may well be the last time I put petrol into my own car, kind of strange feeling.. goodbye petroleum combustion.

On another note I saw QLD are bringing in a new law to stop self sufficiency.. They are going to require all households installing a home charger to connect it to a "controlled load circuit" at the cost of $4k.. The bigger problem is a controlled load circuit runs seperate to the power for the rest of your house and means you CANNOT utilise the power generated by your solar installation to charge your car.

I assume other states will bring that in too, I just hope it isn't retrospective as I will be installing my solar triggered charger (charges when I have excess solar) in a few weeks and that will be a giant waste if I have to get a controlled circuit retrofitted.

https://thedriven.io/2023/06/19/queensl ... -industry/

I read a paragraph on my council's website which said if you buy a block of land connected to, or within a certain distance from the water/sewer line, you still have to pay the rates. I think there's a higher rate after you're connected, but the rule means that if you choose to be off grid, you still have to contribute to the grid if it is available to you. ("grid" here referring to water/sewage services).

I presume the idea is (or was) that the services are meant to be universal, and opting out would concentrate the costs, hitting the poor hardest. The electricity grid is also an essential utility, and it looks like we will be in for a messy and haphazard bunch of new state regulations. (e.g. Victoria's ill-fated EV tax). But the orgy of privatisation over the past few decades has really sabotaged it. It seems pretty shit that the grid provider and the retailer are permitted to charge high prices and cut costs/services for their corporate benefit, while their customers are regulated as if they were using a public utility. I wonder if the authorities will make it work. Maybe you'll be able to get a "jailbroken" solar charger for your car, but would it escape detection? Electricity self-sufficiency is getting cheaper and easier, if they push consumers too hard, then going off-grid could be a tempting option, and AFAIK there's no charge for being "near" the electricity grid if you stop being a customer.

[stylofone]

I had a quick look at the Moruya EV Expo, mostly it was a about a dozen owners putting their cars on display and answering punters' questions. BYD Atto was one of them. The models that would interest me if I was in the market for a new car are the newer, cheaper compact ones, and there was a BYD Dolphin there but I think it was supplied by a company because they are so new and there aren't any owners of that particular model who want to evangelise their new EV. There was also a GWM Ora and (I think) an MG4 there, the latter available through the local dealer in Batemans Bay.

This week I heard another EV story about a driver who plugged in to a public charger which was apparently available, and was subsequently yelled at for jumping the "queue", which had been established by participating in some sort of social media forum where the drivers also gush about their cars and confirm whether any of them had waved to each other because of the sheer excitement vehicle ownership brings them. The whole thing was so unpleasant that this person considered selling their EV.

[Irrev-Black]

Charles Stross is often a source of things I need to think about, and often has a perspective I hadn't counted on.

Today, on Mastodon, he had a bit to say about EVs.

24m
cstross@wandering.shop
Charlie Stross @cstross@wandering.shop

Looking at social media rn and I keep seeing articles about: ever larger, ever more-expensive cars, SUVs and trucks out-selling smaller vehicles, rants calling for the abolition of public transport, hate campaigns directed at cyclists, an insistence that driving is the ONLY valid form of transport—

The car industry is panicking. End of fossil fuel burners plus €10,000 for a car-sized battery pack equals end of a viable motoring economy (cheap second-hand cars can't exist in an EV future).

We haven't had electric cars long enough for them to fully depreciate. But they can't depreciate the way gas-burners do, because an EV with a depleted battery is useless. You have to fit a new-enough battery to your old beater or it won't go anywhere, and the price of a second-hand battery is set by its recycling value: lithium isn't cheap. So, no more £500 good-enough-to-run-for-a-year old cars. So, no more cars for poor people. So, end of mass automobile culture.

Counterpoint ...

There are cheap electric cars (just not in EU and USA). $5000 2-person cars with 100km range in Japan, China, and developig world. But those microcars are designed for shopping and short commutes (not practical in middle America) and still aren't going to depreciate below the residual value of the battery.

The automobile industry isn't going to survive EVs if it can only sell luxury cars at a profit and most of the potential drivers can't afford them.

Starts here:
https://kolektiva.social/@cstross@wande ... 5654951444

[stylofone]

Looking at social media rn and I keep seeing articles about: ever larger, ever more-expensive cars, SUVs and trucks out-selling smaller vehicles, rants calling for the abolition of public transport, hate campaigns directed at cyclists, an insistence that driving is the ONLY valid form of transport

The hate campaigns are really wild, they are such a contrast from the "welcome to the future" image of EVs. They have also gone viral, they are the classic troll-farm style of thing where the instigators plant the seed and then the well-conditioned punters do the hard work for them for free. On my local "community noticeboard" social media forum, even innocuous posts about EVs end up being deleted by moderators because they inevitably create massive flare-ups in the comments.

The $5000 urban transport solutions Stross mentions don't even exist in Australia yet, but looking at the proliferation of e-bikes, you can tell that people would take to them. Here in my new coastal/rural abode, I could definitely make use of one for quick trips to the shops and the pool. Only inter-city travel would be tricky.

Another problem would be that very small urban EVs are still too big for the bike lanes, and they would spark road rage among the haters. For example there are plenty of roads here with 70 and 80 km/h speed limits which would still be very useful for a lot of routes taken by drivers of little cars with a top speed of around 60km/h.