Israel

[wadaye]

Not that it changes anything whether Israel vombed the hospital or not but here is Bellingcat

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/2023/10 ... tal-blast/

[joele]

So far, the findings are inconclusive. Three experts we spoke to say it is not consistent with what you would expect from a typical Israeli air strike with a large munition.

J Andres Gannon, an assistant professor at Vanderbilt University, in the US, says the ground explosions appeared to be small, meaning that the heat generated from the impact may have been caused by leftover rocket fuel rather than an explosion from a warhead.

Justin Bronk, senior research fellow at the UK-based Royal United Services Institute, agrees. While it is difficult to be sure at such an early stage, he says, the evidence looks like the explosion was caused by a failed rocket section hitting the car park and causing a fuel and propellant fire.

Mr Gannon says it is not possible to determine whether the projectile struck its intended target from the footage he has seen. He adds that the flashes in the sky likely indicate the projectile was a rocket with an engine that overheated and stopped working.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67144061

[joele]

The IDF do enough wrong without dishonest reporting.,

A video, broadcast by Al Jazeera and verified by the Guardian, appears to show an airborne weapon following a rising trajectory over Gaza and bursting into flames in mid air. Moments later an explosion is seen at the hospital.

“The crater is not consistent with an airstrike, it is more likely to be a weapon that failed and released its payload over a wide area.

“The crater and surrounding damage is also not consistent with a JDAM aerial bomb. The hole on the ground occurred from kinetic energy.”

Justin Bronk, the senior research fellow for airpower and military technology at RUSI in London, said that while the results were not conclusive, no crater or obvious shrapnel pattern consistent with standard JDAM bombs was visible in images of the aftermath.

“If this is the extent of the damage then I’d say an airstrike looks less likely than a rocket failure causing an explosion and fuel fire,” he added.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/ ... t-to-blame

[wadaye]

We should not be distracted from the issues nonetheless. IDF cuts off water forcing a whole population to either die or Drink unsafe or seawater.
It kills many several thousands of civilians and condemns thousands more uncounted ubder the rouble to die and rot alive or dead.
It kills its owb Israeli and foreign nationals when held by Hamas. They keep them as a defence no doubt agaibst the use of poison gas in the tunnels.
Those who commit genocide will loe in its service. The ultimate lie isthat this was Hamas fault when in fact It is caused bu the occupation.
Yes IDF is equal in kind to the terrorism of Hamas, but much worse in degree

[wadaye]

We should not forget or forgive that the President of the free world spouted hate filled propaganda lies about Hamas decaputating forty babies, leading directly to the murder of a Palestinian child and grievous wounding of his mother in Chicago.
States lie, especially in the service of genocide.
The interests of the Israeli state are different to those of the individual. The interests of the Israeli state is that from the river to the sea Palestine will be no more, and then some. That is that states have an interest in growing and not shrinking. Hence the conflicts in Ukraine and Palestine/Israel.
While we continue to see ourselves as nationals rather than internationals we diminish humanity

[joele]

I am not denying IDF war crimes, or taking away from their importance. But this is further proof that hamas use their own population as human shields.

Double war crime, using hospital as launch site and also using site that civilians are sheltering in to launch rockets.

They constantly deny this but it is important to show hamas don't give two shits about their own civilian's lives. By launching from there they are actively encouraging counter strikes to maximise Palestinian civilian deaths, not to mention the risk of a missfire as happened.

[Irrev-Black]

Fuck Hamas and the IDF/Netanyahu both.

People are turned into pawns, and homes/hospitals/schools become items of strategic value only.

Hamas owes a lot of its early existence to help given by Israel, in order to keep the Palestine Liberation Organisation from gaining ground.

It's villains all the way down, not turtles.

No support or recognition from me for any cause that does other than help people hurt by the fighting.

[Irrev-Black]

Heck of an overview: picks apart "just war" fallacy, examines international rules of war, collective punishment, judicial options.

https://onlysky.media/mclark/moral-war- ... -of-terms/

[stylofone]

Heck of an overview: picks apart "just war" fallacy, examines international rules of war, collective punishment, judicial options.

https://onlysky.media/mclark/moral-war- ... -of-terms/

Everyone is so invested in the middle east, be it for religious, political or other reasons, I sometime wonder whether caring about it so much actually fuels the conflict. If it was seen only as a dispute between those people living on that land, rather than a proxy for religious and political aspirations of much of the rest of the world, would the conflict have been resolved by now? Are we making it worse by caring so much? I'm sure those better versed in the discipline of peace studies have delved into this question which popped into my undisciplined and sketchily educated brain.

[Irrev-Black]

Everyone is so invested in the middle east, be it for religious, political or other reasons, I sometime wonder whether caring about it so much actually fuels the conflict. If it was seen only as a dispute between those people living on that land, rather than a proxy for religious and political aspirations of much of the rest of the world, would the conflict have been resolved by now? Are we making it worse by caring so much? I'm sure those better versed in the discipline of peace studies have delved into this question which popped into my undisciplined and sketchily educated brain.

Somebody said it on hairy elephant place recently: "God is the first recruit in war, and Truth is the first casualty."